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Giants Vs Broncos Preview: Giants Roundtable Week 12

Let’s first start off with a quick recap of the Falcons-Giants game. Obviously with the quick turnaround of this week there will be not be enough time to get to everything we usually get to in the week.

The Giants won the coin-flip game and thus won the game in overtime in a game which neither defense could stop anyone for long periods of time.

I have with me at the table today: Fuchs, Andrew, and Mark.

Game Ball Goes to..?

Eli Manning without a doubt, his best statistical game as a pro

Gotta give it to Eli who had a stellar day in front of his home crowd. I don’t put all the stock in the world in this one stat, but when you have a 112 passer rating in the Meadowlands even with a bad interception to start you off, you had one hell of a day. Eli kept his cool, stayed focused, remained confident and patient — and made some of the best throws under pressure with the game in his hands that I’ve seen him make in a long, long time.
Eli Manning. He was terrific. Without him, the Giants don’t come close to winning this game. 

Couldn’t agree more. Eli Manning was the Quarterback that won a 100 million dollar contract. Eli had to carry this team (he has had to really all season) and he’s improved every year, hopefully the plantar fasciatis (spelling?) is gone and Eli can get back to being the upper echlon, dare I say elite? Quarterback I think he is.

Honorable consideration to Mario Manningham, Kevin Boss, and Michael Boley through the first three and a half quarters.

Did you come away from the Giants game with a better or worse feeling about this team’s prospects?
  Wow. Great question. I feel better about the offense, but worse about the defense. This team could win in a shootout. But, I just don’t trust the defense. I want to. I just can’t. Two games in a row. One they blew it. One they almost did. Like we’ve been saying, the defense just isn’t sticking with what’s working. The pass defense was great all game. They changed when it mattered most. Not good.

Much better. I think the defense is somehow still finding its way… perhaps due to the new rotation with injured players still being plugged into the system while the offense has had all its players in there for a while now, and they seem to be in sync now more than ever. The defense I think will come around, but playing like the 2007 Giants may never happen again. They ran an Eagle-esque 60% blitz scheme — including packages where half came straight from Jim Johnson’s playbook. This ain’t 2007 anymore, and Spags is sorely missed. Bill Sheridan needs to watch some tape and figure out how the Giants used to get pressure from 4 or 5 guys and at the same time clamp down on the middle of the field that has been wide open for all of 2009. I think they will figure it out by crunch time, but right now I think they are still getting the bones down.

I hate to say it but worse.  The weather is only going to get worse in New York, the Giants can’t run the ball, Manning will eventually be bothered by the wind and the defense is still bad. 

I would say worse. I thought the Giants should have rolled over Atlanta.

Gives me pause for concern. The Giants can make the playoffs, but they won’t do anything if they dont play better.

If they continue to struggle, we’ll see what Jerry Reese can do with good drafting position (the last time he picked 20th or higher was the 2007 draft class…how’s that class?)

let’s hope though the Giants are picking 32nd.

Final Observations about the Giants/Falcons game…?

The Giants seemed to employ the old red herring technique when issuing bullet points to the press about their game plan, and I was taken hook, line, and sinker. They didn’t get back to the run, they didn’t wear out Jacobs and go for 100 yards rushing, they didn’t play possession football with short passes. They went deep consistently and it completely paid off this time. So I guess they were able to find something that worked well and stuck with it over 60 minutes, kudos to the players and coaches for coming up big on offense when they needed to. Kevin Boss was FINALLY utilized to the point where he was double covered, leaving Madison Hedgecock of all people open for an easy touchdown. That offense had the word dynamic all over it Sunday — I was pleased with the play calling and the execution. I’m not worried about the run anymore, it seems like the Giants are committed to beating teams through the air first to offset the extra pressure applied to the run game. If it works early — fine, stick with it. But I only get concerned when the passing game has an off day for whatever reason and the Giants fail to adjust. We’ll see how it goes — but I think we can still call on the run game to carry the load if we need it. The backs are being under used as it is — I think they’ll be fresh for the second half of the season because of this scheme. Maybe that pays off down the road here.

Credit that win to Eli Manning, the receivers and the offensive line.

They should not have won that game. But they did. Maybe this is a turning point. I’m not sure. We’ll have to see.

 Offensive line needs a makeover in the off-season. I’ve been saying for awhile, but here’s what’s going to happen. William Beatty is going to take over at LT, David Diehl is moving inside to LG (is natrual and probably better position) or moving across way to Right Tackle and the Giants are going to find a replacement at Left Guard.

In competition, sometimes people get complacent.

Shake things up on the offensive line, hope they respond.

Eli has been running for his life often this year (Atlanta has no pass rush) and there is no push on the offensive line.

Bigger threat this game Brandon Marshall or Eddie Royal (Keep in mind Royal handles most of the return duties as well)?

 

 

Brandon Marshall is the biggest threat, without question. I know you guys keep harping on Special Teams and the return game coverage but how many touchdowns have the Giants allowed on returns again? Now take that stat and compare it to the Giants points against numbers, especially in the red zone. Marshall is what worries me, especially if they hit him in motion over the middle on a cross. They need to solve that issue, big time.

 

 

Royal. I think Webster can cover Marshall. Do I trust Thomas, or Ross on the quick Royal? Not sure. Royal is explosive. He’ll make guys miss. He could have a big game

 really depends on what Corey Webster shows up.  Right now I would still have to say Brandon Marshall, even with his off-field troubles he is a great wide out

I 100% agree with Mark. it depends on Corey Webster plays. Webster is a pro-bowl caliber talent (no apperances yet) who had a couple of bad games (although few DB can cover Vincent Jackson 1-1).

I have faith in Webster. The Thing about Marshall is he’s good after the catch, the Giants are O.K. with that. They have had much more problems with guys who create a ton of seperation with speed and elusiveness (like Eddie Royal). Eddie Royal could be a big factor on Turkey Day.more impressive rookie so far this season…Knowshown Moreno (600 yards rushing 77 yards receiving 3 touchdowns) or Hakeem Nicks (472 yards receiving 9 yards rushing)?
  Nicks. Nicks missed a couple games too, keep in mind. Moreno is a great rookie. Going to be a great player. But right now, Nicks is more impressive.

I would say Nicks because it is tougher to play wide receiver then running back.

Hakeem Nicks has more big plays I think. Every fourth catch is for over 20 yards — and he’s a big time deep threat that can only take away coverage from somebody else. I really like the way he’s come along and he seems to be open all the time — big physical guy that creates separation early. I like him a ton. Between Nicks, Manningham, and Smith — Eli has some options out there.

I think both have had good seasons. I was actually hoping in the draft that Moreno would fall to the Giants, but I’m very happy with what Hakeem Nicks has done. He’s better than I thought he would be. I originally liked Kenny Britt more, and even though it’s early, early returns are that Nicks could be the better player.

Imagine if the Colts had chosen Nicks over Donald Brown (jeez!)

Do you think the Broncos will be able to run effectively against what has been an unspiring defense?
The Broncos always seem to run well no matter who they are playing.  I would take the Giants run defense before their pass defense right now.  I do think the Moreno and Co will put up decent yards on Turkey Day. 

I don’t trust either defensive unit. Four weeks or so ago I told everyone the problem wasn’t the secondary, or the linebackers as much as it was the defensive tackles which have been awful. The DT’s have been awful this year.

Hopefully Canty gets it going. and Rocky Bernard is going to find himself on the unemployement line at the end of the season if he doesn’t remember how to play football.
What kind of impact will the atmosphere in Denver have on the Giants?

 
  It’ll have a big impact. Thanksgiving night. The place will be rocking. Giants don’t do great in loud stadiums. We’ll see a lot of false starts.

I am really very nervous about this for Thursday’s game. The Giants have been awful in the 4th quarter this year. If the game is close and the Giants have to deal with sucking in air the whole fourth quarter thi sgame could turn into a disaster.

 

 

Can the Giants stop Elvis Dumervil who has 12 sacks (more than the whole Giants team….ok that’s an exaggeration) this Thursday?

  I say this all the time too, but that Eli gets rid of the ball pretty quickly and avoids a lot of sacks. I think there has been much, too much pressure on Eli this year, but not a ton of sacks. Hopefully Diehl has a superior game and keeps Dumervil out of the backfield. If they do that they should have a good game passing the ball against an aging secondary.

The Giants have not allow a ton of sacks this year (knocks on wood), Eli is getting more and more elusive, the backs are getting better at picking up the blitz… I say they allow no more than 2 sacks.

 

 

Is someone going to make a play on defense this weekend, in the secondary?

 

 

Yes — but you pose that question like Justin Tuck didnt have 2 strip sacks last weekend.  😉

 

 

Mario Manningham had a huge game vs the Falcons…do you think it was a product of Manningham finally figuring out what to do on the football field or the porous Atlanta defense?
  A little bit of both. Manningham is starting to figure out what the hell he’s doing out there. Slowly but surely, we’ll see him have a full grasp of it. But, the Atlanta defense certainly helped him.

Hopefully, Manningham has figured it out.  I don’t love Todd McShay, but he was one of the VERY few draftniks who was clamoring that Mario Manningham should be drafted int he mid to late 1st round.

I watched Mannigham play at Michigan, and still can’t believe how quick is intial burst ais and how well he moves after he catches the ball.

If he ever becomes the route runner Steve Smith is…look out.

Brandon Jacobs, Danny Ware and Bradshaw combined for under a 100 yards for the game against one of the worst run defenses in the league? are the running backs playing poorly, is it the offensive line, or are the stats misleading?

I just don’t think it’s been that big a part of the game plan this year — they keep saying it will be but I’m now of the mind that they are using the #1 rushing team stat from last year as red herring. They want people to think they are desperately trying to establish a big run game but really they are trying to exploit the resulting stacked box by making plays through the air. Their actions speak louder than words — they have committed to making big passing plays work.  When it’s working, great — stay with that game plan. My problem is with the off days and not changing gears to utilize your rushing weapoins. Both need to be called upon and effective once you get a feel for what the defense is doing. Easier said than done of course, but that’s the goal — a complete team with unlimited weapons. We saw them stay with the pass with New Orleans and Arizona – but it wasn’t working then. San Diego was more like what they used to do — less big plays for Manning and its a control the clock situation. They accomplished it with ok running numbers, and offensively did well enough. Defense let the game get away. But last game the receivers and Manning looked like they were a well oiled machine, completely in sync and working together seamlessly. If in Denver that thin air makes it easier to go long and the matchups are favorable — yeah stay with the run. But if Eli is over throwing, then adjusting to a short pass and run scheme is what I want to see before the 4th quarter when it’s too late.
  
I think the OLine is underperforming. It appears Bradshaw is going to be out this Week. Danny Ware has been great in blitz pickup. Hopefully he gets a chance to run this Thursday and show us what he’s made of. He might be an energy boost.
  
Do you think all of the night  and prime time games have worn down on the Giants this season?
No not really I think the problem has been a combination of injuries, poor play calling and unfortunately poor off season pick ups.  Boley has really been the only free agent to step up this season. 
  

Is the Boss man here to stay?
  He better be. I still can’t figure out why the Giants neglected to use him early on in the year. You see what he can do when the ball is thrown his way. He makes plays. Keep him in, Gilbride. You won’t be sorry.

  

 

He doesn’t get open right off the line like a lot of eliete Tight ends do, but he has great hands and can hold onto the ball after contact. He’s also huge so hopefully more use in the red zone.

 

 

Where did Travis Beckum go…did he disappear to the same place the return game has gone?

 

 

OK, you have to stop with the Hixon bashing. That 34 yard return in OT helped set up the game winning field goal — and he nearly had that kind of production on 2 other returns. He’s basically there — it only takes one big play to help in a win and Hixon delivered at the most crucial time of the game. He gets a nod from me this week.

 

 

Who is the X-factor for the Broncos?
  Brian Dawkins. He’s a Giant killer. He always makes plays. With the Giants doing such a good job in the middle of the field in the passing game, you can bet Dawkins will be there. He may be older. But he can still be dangerous.

 Eddie Royal and Josh McDaniels game planning on offense. And Dumervil on defense.

Anything else to add…?
  
I realize that the loss of Pierce hurts the Giants and that is probably the reason we didn’t see more of Sintim on Sunday because Pierce has been an on-field coach but when do these young guys get a shot.  Things can’t be much worse then whats on the field right now?  P.S. thanks for remembering the huge tight end who continues to make plays.

 

Mid game adjustments — thats the key to this game for me. I don’t know that a short week favors a detailed game plan in this situation so I think based on what the defense is giving you, you find a way to win another must win game on the road, in the moment. I’d love to see Denver EXPECT a pass heavy attack, and the Giants plan for that and run all over them. But I just don’t think other teams believe in that formula. I think they take their chances with the ball in Eli’s hands and try to get physical in the secondary. Denver might do well to stick with that plan, then again they might get dominated with a trademark Giants zag. Looking forward to the game… hope you all have a great Thanksgiving.

 

 

  

I’ve been looking forward to this game for awhile. The Giants never play on Thanksgiving! Now this is Thanksgiving night! I can’t wait to have football and turkey. It’s going to be fun, win or lose.

Final prediction for the Giants/Broncos game?

If Orton continues to be out: 31-10 Giants

I don’t like these quick turnarounds, for either team. The Broncos are reeling a bit, having lost 4 in a row. The home field advantage is big, but I like the Giants. Final Score: Giants 28, Broncos 21

 
Both teams are struggling, the Giants have to travel on short rest but I think they are playing better then the Broncos.  Giants 20 Broncos 14
 
In recent years I would say that there is no chance that the Broncos can win this game on Thursday night, but this isn’t recent years. And this is 2009. The good thing about the matchup with the Broncos is that they don’t match up well with the Giants, much like the Falcons did not match up well with the Giants.
  
The Jints have been getting dominated by teams with good tight ends  and quarterback play.
  
The Cowboys (witten), the Eagles (celek), the Saints (shockey) and the Chargers (Gates) gave the Giants big time problems on defense. The Giants also lost to the Cardinals, but that game was poor offensive execution more than anything.
  
The Broncos don’t have a great weapon at Tight End, they don’t have elite running backs, and they don’t have a good quarterback (they have a game manager type quarterback). I don’t think they have the talent the New York Giants have.
  
Will the Giants win this game?

If they want to keep their season alive they will.
 
Giants 24 Broncos 21.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As for Beckum — I’ll take Kevin Boss any day of the week and twice (for two touchdowns) on Sundays. 

For the record, I think it’s more the blocking in the return game than I think it is Domenik Hixon.

I still think Travis Beckum should be used as an H-back.

 

Can Champ Bailey handle Steve Smith?
I think Smith is beginning to wear down a bit but he is such a good route runner and student of the game.  I’m sure Smith will have another solid outing again on Thursday

I think he can. Bailey is not an elite athlete, Smith isn’t either. Bailey is smart and savvy though, which could give Smith some problems. I think Bialey honestly migh thave more trouble keeping up with a go route from Mannigham than with smith.
 
How do we fix this defense?
  I think it starts up front. The front four have to do a better job of getting pressure. We shouldn’t have to bring Boley every other play. I want to see Osi and Tuck in the backfield all the time. Rocky Bernard has been a disappointment. If the Giants can get strong pressure with their front four, everything else will fall into place.

  

 

 Let’s go D tackles.

 

I think these kind of games take teams out of their rhythm. And they’ve had a lot of them. I think it’s had an effect on the team.

But I think what you’re looking for is 6 sacks and two interceptions…. if the Denver QB is anyone but Orton then yes, they may just accomplish those numbers. It would be great to see Aaron Ross shake off the last cob web and get a pick, but that might be over the top.

  

No one is making plays when it matters (late in the 4th quarter).

Someone step-up.

Mitch Berger is averagin a paltry 40.8 yards per punt with only 4 inside the 20, Jeff Feagles is averaging an even worse 39.8 yard per punt…who is in better position to capitalize on these poor yards per punt this Thursday?
The Broncos because the Giants return game hasn’t done squat basically all year. 

The Giants have to add “Punter” and probably Kicker to the list of positions to upgrade in the off-season.

I mean the Giants will get back Phillips, Alford, Andre Brown and I imagine they will add another defensive tackle in the draft, but punter and kicker are two areas that might need to be addressed. Tynes has lost all power on his kick offs and Feagles has been abysmal.


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5 Responses to “Giants Vs Broncos Preview: Giants Roundtable Week 12”

  1. CMH says:

    This would be a great time for Osi to get loose and have a big game.

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